In Depth Spoilers - First Episode

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Boudica
Posts: 115
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:50 am

Mon Jul 10, 2017 8:42 am

Some people claimed that they have seen the first episode, this is from the Freefolk reddit, users GOTit1111, LaLaLandSucks12

From user GOTit1111:

So first scene opens with the Tullys having another dinner. Celebrating the Red Wedding. Walder Frey is alive, hehe no its Arya obviously. She essentially cheers on the entire Frey family and gets them to drink poison during her speech to them that eventually becomes more obvious that shes not who she appears to be. Gives epic ass fucking speech while they all die about leaving a wolf alive was a big mistake and now the sheep are being slaughtered. She leaves the women alive because they dont have any part in it.

Second scene is Cersei over a man painting a giant map of Westeros and Jamie comes in they have a talk about enemies from the north south east and west. Then the Greyjoys show up with a fleet and where Euron offers his navy if Cersei marries him. She refuses but he says something about giving her an invaluable gift upon his return and she wont be able to refuse him.
Quick scene where Bran and whats her face cant remember her name finally show up to the wall, Nights Watch let them in.

Next is a dinner scene with Jon at Winterfell with all the houses of the North where the begin their strategy of fighting the White Walkers. Sansa undermines his authority in front of the houses because she thinks the houses that betrayed Ned should be replaced by loyal familiies where Jon doesnt think children of said traitors should be punished for their mistakes. He gets the two kids of the two houses the pledge allegiance and everyone cheers on Jon for being a cool dude.
Second follow up is Sansa and Jon having a bit of back and forth about what she just did but she makes good points about him and saying dont be stupid like Ned. Ned was noble and so was Robb but it got them killed so be smarter.

They get a raven with a message from Cersei saying bend the knee or die. Sansas like ohhhh no you dont know her jon she crazy, Jons like bitch please we united the north and winter is here with a thousand miles of snow and they are a southern army. They cant do shit.
Baelish tries to woo Sansa quick but shes like I know your moves bud buzz off.

Also hilarious scene between that wildling dude and whats her name (Fuck I should probably rewatch the last season this week names are escaping me). She is training with Tyrions old trainee guy dude and she throws him in a pile of snow and the Wildling guys like with the funniest/creepiest face says "You are a very lucky man" Its funny as hell and will be talk of the episode I gurantee it.
Final notable scene is Danaerys and crew rolling up to Dragonstone where the clean the place up and end up at the giant map that Stannis banged the Red Witch on and she says "Sha'll we begin?" To Tyrion and cue credits and epic music.

(Sam) Yeah he finds a book that says underneath Dragonstone is a giant mine of dragonglass they can use to fight white walkers

(Tormund) him and the wildlings are being sent to what Jon believes will be the first line of defense against the white walkers. I cant remember what castle was mentioned they will be stationed at but its at the wall close to the sea.

(Tormund) So no dailogue is heard between Brienne and him because when he goes up to talk to her it cuts to sansa looking at them and thats when t he scene between her and baelish starts. Brienne looks visibly uncomfortable though

Hey so yeah no Edmure unfortunately. Jon isnt so much angry as he is just pointing it out. Sansa says he is good at being a leader but he needs to be better. This all happens after the meeting with the houses of the north. The scene with the raven is directly tied to their scene together but happens after they have a brief conversation about Jon having to be better than Ned and Rob.

(Sansa and Littlefinger) Yeah for sure. No big bits of information are revealed its more of a setup scene id say for later episodes illustrating their relationship. Brienne interrupts them and asks why is he still there (he leaves at this point) Sansa mentions that without Baelish we wouldnt of taken Winterfell. Hes earned his right to stay.
Its essentially Petyr trying to get into her head (perhaps to take winterfell for herself) and shes having none of it.

there is a cameo of Jorah Mormont who is now in the Maesters Citadel locked up because of the grey scale. Sam is taking the sicks empty food bowls cell by cell and when he goes to take Jorahs his hand lashes out for a jump scare. He asks if The Dragon Queen or Danaerys I cant remember has arrived yet. Sam, terrified answers no than Jorah goes back into his cell in the shadows. His face is never shown but you can tell its him by his voice, which is very distinct.

oh also i forgot the big part with Sam being at the Maester Citadel. Theres like a cool scene where it compares him cleaning up old mens shit and feeding porridge to everyone else while he tries to sneak into the restricted zone to get restricted books. He eventually finds a book that says Dragonstone has an underground mountain full of Dragonglass to be mined.

Cersei thinks destroying all the houses against her is gonne be easy (shes getting really cocky) and Jaime is being more realistic. He mentions that now winter is here we need food and shelter for them and the horses which we dont have stuff like that. Hes the head of the Lannister military so he gives her military advice.

Jaime insists they talk about Tommen killing himself and they are the only Lannisters left. Cersei calls Tommen a traitor and thats the end of it.

Jaime visibly gets jealous when Euron offers his hand in marriage. He also has a back and forth with him about when the Lannisters invaded the Iron Islands during Roberts Rebellion. Says he admired Jaime for how easily he slaughtered the Greyjoys. Jaime says something a long the lines of that being his family how could he enjoy it and he says something about if he didnt do that he wouldnt of been exiled and wouldnt of been the greatest captain in all of the sea or some shit

Also Sam breaks into the restricted area in the library by stealing the keys of a master maester who is sleeping. This all happens when he is denied by a Master whilst doing an autopsy. Sam is weighing heart and a brain. Theres a back and forth where the master tells Sam that whenever big moments in history have happened, everyone thought it was gonna be the end of the world but it never came to be. He claims he believes Sam believes the White Walkers are real, but shows doubt. He denies Sam the right to look at the books and this is why he steals them.

(Jon) He restates his position on the houses, Sansa goes on a big rant about traitors should be punished he cuts her off and justifies his reasons this is where he talks about not punishing the younger generations for the actions of the older. He does it and gives her a "Dude really?!" face.

(The opening scene) yes opening scene is night king marching to wall with the wildling giant apart of the army

Okay yeah I mentioned this earlier and Im sticking by it even though it doesnt match up with what we know thus far. Theres several giants bu they focus on one specifically. And I thought for sure it was WUN WUN. But someone pointed out he died in winterfell which is true. Now logically this cant be Wun Wun but the imply it is him HEAVILY. Like they zoom right into his face and if its not him it sure as hell looks exactly like him. Has a missing eye and everything from the wound from the arrow. So if its Wun Wun its a massive plot hole, if its not then its pretty damn misleading.

(Arya) Nope thanks for reminding me forgot that she rides a horse towards Kings Landing and bumps into Lannister guards who are on their way to investigate what happened at the Twins. She is noticebaly nervous but the Lannister troops are super chill, offer her food and drink. They sing a song together (whos the redhead pop singer from England? This is his cameo). They tell her stories about being a soldier in the Lannister army and she visibly feels sorry for them, especially the one guy who misses his family and talks about him being a new father hoping it is a girl so she doesnt get sent to fight other mens wars if it were a boy instead. Really powerful scene actually

(Arya) They also ask her why shes headed to Kings Landing. She replies that shes going to kill the queen. They all lmao. its funny.

Yeah nothing about Edmure which is suprising. I think Arya is on a kill mission not family reunion.

Sure I can asnwer specifics. Mostly Jon is talking to all the houses about his plans for the upcoming invasion. He insists that all men women and children boys and girls train to fight. Saying that we woint win if half the population just sits there. The young girl from that Bear house gets in one guys face who objects. She says something along the lines of "Im not gonna sit and knit while my north fights for its survival" pretty badass. Sansa keeps interrupting Jon especially when it comes to what to do with the houses who betrayed. He asks the new leaders of the houses which is a red haired girl and a younger boy to come forward and pledge allegiance which they do ionce they draw out there swords and bend the knee. Im happy to get more specific with certain scenes i watched it a week ago though so I wont be able to recite word for word on absolutely everything but Ill try to my best ability.

(Sansa) Some could see her coming off annoying. I found her extremely ballsy talking down to Jon in front of everyone but he gets the last word and puts her in her place proper.

Honestly the music was pretty uneventful. There was none of that like someone drops an epic one liner or a bad ass confrontation and no epic music to drop it over. I would say the most notable part music wise is with the reveal of the NK and the white walkers and giants marching towards what I assume is the wall and its this slow building crescendo which peaks once it gets to the Giants face then cuts to Bran warging back into himself. Theres reasons why I cant take screenshots but I cant delve into details into how and why I was able to view this stuff for obvious reasons. Im a tad paranoid in that regard

The Hound and the Red preist and flaming sword dude reach a farm. Same one Arya and The Hound were at many seasons ago. The Father and Daughter who use to live there have died from starvation. Hound and Flaming Sword dude have a conversation about if a god exists why is it so cruel hence why hound doesnt bother with that kind of shit. Priest asks him to look into the flames and tell him what he sees. Hound reluctantly does it. Sees a vision of a giant mountain shaped as an arrow head. Priest is like now do you believe and the Hound is clearly unsettled.

Theres a good scene where The Hound buries the Daughter and Father who are now just skeletons and he tries to recite the seven gods prayer but cant remember it and is like fuck it im sorry this happened to you. Red Priest guy and him have a quiet somber moment. He also takes a jab at his man bun which is hilarious says "Your not fooling anyone with that" or something along those lines

If I remember correctly the scene with Arya and the Tullys is the pre credits opener than post credits it cuts to white walker march than cut to Bran warging back into himself at the front of the gates of the wall. Then wall gate opens and conversation with the Nights Watch happens. Bran says his ned startks son, they say how do we know, than Bran proceeds to tell him he saw buddy fight at some place and gives some details and they believe it and let him in.

(Dany) deff less than 3 mins, maybe 3 at the very most. Its the very final scene, no dialogue spoken till the last second

Jorah is in the episode albeit briefly. Hes in a cell at the Maester Citadel. He reaches out to Sam through an opening in the cell door used for giving and taking food. Hand and arm exposed covered in Greyscale. He asks if Danaerys has arrived, sam says no and he puts his hand back inside and you can kinda see his face in the darkness but they tease how bad his greyscale has gotten not revealing too much

If its not Wun Wun it reallyu looks like him. They zoom right into his face. Same hair same build. Hes not the only giant as well theres maybe three more behind him. I remember what you mention with Wun Wun so it might not be him but they deffinitely imply that it is.

Cersei asks jamie where he thinks Dany and Tyrion will land. He mentions dragonstone for obvious reasons. Then we see Dany in the end scene when they arrive to Dragonstone. She removes a Baratheon Banner when they enter.

(Dragons) Yes briefly. When Dany is approaching Dragonstone with her fleet, the dragons fly over and ahead towards it. Next scene is them coming to shore on smaller boats with her entourage and some unsullied. The place is deserted they enter the main gate, make their way to the throne and admire it a bit. Then a scene where she removes Baratheon banner and then they arrive in the map room which is all dusty and abandoned. This is when Dany turns to Tyrion and says "shall we begin"

No scene of the Greyjoys. Just Euron at Kings Landing but theres also a shot of his fleet and it is MASSIVE. Much larger than Daenarys'.

Theres on where Jamie and Cersei look out over the sea thats where Eurons Fleet is revealed and Jaime protests saying they Greyjoys are nothing but weak people who steal only becasue they cant grow food themselves. She mentions they are here for a queen. Also the scene I mentioned with Jamie and Cersei standing above a massive map of Westeros being painted by a painter. Then the one with the Iron Throne where Euron makes his proposition. He moves forward and Zombie Mountain steps in front threateningly. Euron backs off.

(Cersei) She says something to Jaime along the lines of "40 years of listening to father and you think I didnt learn anything?"

Yeah she believes nothing can stop her now but Jaime is like uhhhhh no sis like your surrounded in all fronts youve pissed off the entirety of westeros and now winter is here. You gotta plan this right.


From user LaLaLandSucks12

- There is absolutely no revolt. It's just HBO hyping stuff with the episode descriptions.
- Arya sees a couple going at it in the inn, that explains the sexual content.
- He says OP missed a scene in episode 1 where The Hound and the brotherhood to a house and find 2 dead bodies. Sandor earns the respect of Beric and thoros by burying the bodies.

(Dany receiving an unexpected visitor) It's Melisandre

(Information from episode 2)
- He says the episode is amazing and is easily top 10 material. The sea battle is insane and Euron is actually very creepy. The last scene is Theon in the water watching the flames of the ships with tears in his eyes. Sadly we see nothing from that Ellaria and Yara sex scene, it's just kissing.
- Arya is at an Inn and she wants to go to King's Landing and try to kill Cersei, Se also mentions Illyn Payne. However she sees Hot Pie and he tells her Cersei is dangerous and she blew up the Sept and the Starks have taken winterfell and she gets really happy. And she decides to go to Winterfell.
- Jon receives a raven from Dany and he decides to go to make an alliance and take dragonglass. Before he leaves he has a quick scene with Ghost, send Tormund to Eastwatch, and makes Sansa in charge. He goes to the crypts and he breaks down in front of Neds statue. Littlefinger sees this and tries to get into his skin, but Jon chokeslammes him. Very powerful set of scenes for Jon.
- Many political scenes in dragonstone with ALL of Danys allies. Tyrion is back to his old self planning the war and being witty.
- Cersei convinces Randyl Tarly to betray the Tyrrells. Randyl says to his son that after he's done with the Tyrrells he'll go to old town to take care of Sam.
- Jorah arrives in Oldtown, he looks like shit.
- Littlefinger tries to convince Royce to betray Jon and support Sansa but Royce tells him to fuck off.

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Flayed Potatoes
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Mon Jul 10, 2017 1:47 pm

Oh wow thank you for posting these. Glad to have some context to the scenes, especially the ones in the north. I guess we'll see when the episode airs how accurate this is.

1. This set of leaks sounds a bit better than what Lads 1 and 2 gave us, but this also means those cringey leaked pages might be legit so ugh. Maybe they'll alter the dialogue or something.

2. Poor Jorah. :( Like damn.

3. Sam's scenes are a riot. :lol: Maybe he can find the cloak of invisibility and sneak into the restricted section and... err wrong character :P

4. I was afraid Jon would argue with Lyanna, so hopefully this new set of leaks proves accurate. Sansa needs to chill... I wish the Winterfell plot was a bit better though, especially post-Jon's departure. I get that the show needs to keep Littlefinger as long as possible to give other characters something to do, but I feel like it's hindering those other characters.

5. Good idea to have Arya's scene as a cold open and then Bran/NK post opening. I really, really hope this is true. Sounds like an explosive set of scenes and good way to start the season.

6. Laughing forever at Littlefinger flopping in front of Sansa, Jon, and Royce.

Boudica
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Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:50 am

Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:07 pm

Flayed Potatoes wrote:
Mon Jul 10, 2017 1:47 pm
Oh wow thank you for posting these. Glad to have some context to the scenes, especially the ones in the north. I guess we'll see when the episode airs how accurate this is.

1. This set of leaks sounds a bit better than what Lads 1 and 2 gave us, but this also means those cringey leaked pages might be legit so ugh. Maybe they'll alter the dialogue or something.

2. Poor Jorah. :( Like damn.

3. Sam's scenes are a riot. :lol: Maybe he can find the cloak of invisibility and sneak into the restricted section and... err wrong character :P

4. I was afraid Jon would argue with Lyanna, so hopefully this new set of leaks proves accurate. Sansa needs to chill... I wish the Winterfell plot was a bit better though, especially post-Jon's departure. I get that the show needs to keep Littlefinger as long as possible to give other characters something to do, but I feel like it's hindering those other characters.

5. Good idea to have Arya's scene as a cold open and then Bran/NK post opening. I really, really hope this is true. Sounds like an explosive set of scenes and good way to start the season.

6. Laughing forever at Littlefinger flopping in front of Sansa, Jon, and Royce.

1. I really dislike that dialogue from the Lads2 script, it is not just the dialogue it is also the way Arya fangirls over Sansa, and Jon supposedly kneeling in the Dragonpit in front of practically everyone in Westeros. According to these spoilers from the first episode the script is not exactly the same, but there are some similarities. I guess we can only hope that it has been revised a lot.

2. Yes, poor Jorah, grayscale really spreads damn fast.

3. Lol that is exactly what I was also thinking, the Citadel has a Harry Potter feel to it. Sam's story this season could be quite interesting.

4. Yes, I am also glad that Lyanna is still supporting Jon. In truth it didn't really make much sense for Lyanna to suddenly go against Jon and side with Sansa. It is also good to see that Jon will be taking command. It is strange that Sansa would try to speak out against him public.
It is also good to confirm that the Lords of the Vale are actually behind him. But as you say this makes Littlefinger's plotting very single minded. It could become very one dimensional at Winterfell this season. But then again this is the part of the problem for a plotter such as Littlefinger, he can't plot in complete isolation. If other people are not willing to take part in his schemes then he has a problem.

The White Walkers and Dany arriving in Westeros is also a very big problem for him. He can't do anything about the White Walkers and Dany spoils his plans of sitting on the iron throne. In some ways he might be stuck. I am glad that Jon will not remain in Winterfell with Sansa and Littlefinger, it can't lead to anything good character wise. Then again I don't know what the point is of making Jon appear as if he is really taking charge and doing a good job, only then for him to kneel in the Dragonpit. (I don't mind having Jon kneeling in private, but the Dragonpit kneeling is really dumb :roll: ).

5. I think it would work better to have the White Walkers as the cold opening, and Arya as the first scene. But then again we have already seen White Walkers as a cold opening so perhaps they don't want to hand the cold opening to the same subject matter. Honestly, I really don't care for this idea of Arya only murdering the Frey men and letting all of the women go free.

6. Yes, it sound like a lot of flopping from Littlefinger. :lol:
A lot of people love Littlefinger, but I personally really want to see the end of him, perhaps it would be good to see him making some mistakes before his death.


The Cersei and Jaime scenes from the first episode does not sound that exciting, but it will be fun to see Cersei getting a few victories over Dany's massive force. It is also strange to name the episode Dragonstone only to have Dany for 3 minutes at the end.
Then again these spoilers might fake, I don't know, I have feeling they are not fake but there are a few strange elements to these spoilers that doesn't fit. Then again it is only six days until the new season starts, so we don't have to wait long to know for sure.

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Flayed Potatoes
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Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:46 pm

Boudica wrote:
Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:07 pm

1. I really dislike that dialogue from the Lads2 script, it is not just the dialogue it is also the way Arya fangirls over Sansa, and Jon supposedly kneeling in the Dragonpit in front of practically everyone in Westeros. According to these spoilers from the first episode the script is not exactly the same, but there are some similarities. I guess we can only hope that it has been revised a lot.

2. Yes, poor Jorah, grayscale really spreads damn fast.

3. Lol that is exactly what I was also thinking, the Citadel has a Harry Potter feel to it. Sam's story this season could be quite interesting.

4. Yes, I am also glad that Lyanna is still supporting Jon. In truth it didn't really make much sense for Lyanna to suddenly go against Jon and side with Sansa. It is also good to see that Jon will be taking command. It is strange that Sansa would try to speak out against him public.
It is also good to confirm that the Lords of the Vale are actually behind him. But as you say this makes Littlefinger's plotting very single minded. It could become very one dimensional at Winterfell this season. But then again this is the part of the problem for a plotter such as Littlefinger, he can't plot in complete isolation. If other people are not willing to take part in his schemes then he has a problem.

The White Walkers and Dany arriving in Westeros is also a very big problem for him. He can't do anything about the White Walkers and Dany spoils his plans of sitting on the iron throne. In some ways he might be stuck. I am glad that Jon will not remain in Winterfell with Sansa and Littlefinger, it can't lead to anything good character wise. Then again I don't know what the point is of making Jon appear as if he is really taking charge and doing a good job, only then for him to kneel in the Dragonpit. (I don't mind having Jon kneeling in private, but the Dragonpit kneeling is really dumb :roll: ).

5. I think it would work better to have the White Walkers as the cold opening, and Arya as the first scene. But then again we have already seen White Walkers as a cold opening so perhaps they don't want to hand the cold opening to the same subject matter. Honestly, I really don't care for this idea of Arya only murdering the Frey men and letting all of the women go free.

6. Yes, it sound like a lot of flopping from Littlefinger. :lol:
A lot of people love Littlefinger, but I personally really want to see the end of him, perhaps it would be good to see him making some mistakes before his death.


The Cersei and Jaime scenes from the first episode does not sound that exciting, but it will be fun to see Cersei getting a few victories over Dany's massive force. It is also strange to name the episode Dragonstone only to have Dany for 3 minutes at the end.
Then again these spoilers might fake, I don't know, I have feeling they are not fake but there are a few strange elements to these spoilers that doesn't fit. Then again it is only six days until the new season starts, so we don't have to wait long to know for sure.
1. You know I totally agree with you. It sounds like AO3 fanfic written by Sansa and Dany fans. That script better be a ROUGH draft because it's basically character assassination for Jon and Arya. Not to mention Bran not doing anything until the end because the show needs to pretend Sansa is soooo smart and political.

4. Totally agree. She just crowned him king and two minutes later she's like 'nope'? Doesn't make sense at all. I'm really going to enjoy the Royce scene if true because everyone was acting like there's no way Jon can negotiate with the Vale himself and have them be loyal to him. Ha ha ha.

4.5. "Then again I don't know what the point is of making Jon appear as if he is really taking charge and doing a good job. Only then for him to kneel in the Dragonpit. (I don't mind having Jon kneeling in private, but the Dragonpit kneeling is really dumb :roll: " 100% agree. Private... sure ok. But the public one is just no. They make him king only to rule for like a handful of episodes and then humiliate him and proceed to fawn over their actual favorite characters. I'm not a fan.

The only plot-reason this dumb kneeling business might make sense is to throw us off the scent, and then turn things around by making Jon king of Westeros in the end (oh no). If that is the plan, the way they allegedly went about it is stupid as hell. And really the only way Jon would ever be king is if Dany dies, and frankly I don't see that happening lmao. I also don't see Dany stepping down because he's the true heir or some bullcrap lol. Like "I worked all my life to sit on this chair, but you're ahead in the line of succession, so you should have it over me. I insist." sounds terrible.

The other reason might be to try and make us believe there might be drama between Jon and Dany when his parentage is revealed, but it's also really stupid because Jon would never press a claim over something he doesn't want. Jonerys has 0 conflict. Jon would just let Dany be queen if she wants it so bad. He's not going to go around calling himself "blood of the dragon" when he finds out who his parents are.

5. I don't particularly like the idea either because it's a bit contradictory. She says Freys made the mistake of letting Starks live and she does the same thing to the Frey women. Who is to say the survivors won't take revenge? The women probably have kids of their own lmao. It seems like fanservice with a dose of whitewashing, and trying to convince viewers it's a great feminist moment, when in fact depicting all the Frey women as helpless and useless isn't feminist at all. It really stands out when you look at the amount of female characters who are capable of scheming and killing that already exist on the show. I think it should have been a mixed group of male and female adults, if the show really wanted to go in that direction. What are your objections to the scene?

6. Littlefinger even being alive at this point is a plot hole. GRRM also goes to great lengths to keep him around. I can't wait for him to die.

Dragonstone is such a meh title. Can't wait for Cersei to fuck everyone up lol

Boudica
Posts: 115
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Tue Jul 11, 2017 11:03 pm

1. I also hope it will be heavily revised. Although it still feels like some of that script pages was someone who had access to a lot of information, but they also wanted to troll certain parts of the fanbase. The best way to do something like that, would be to give out some real spoilers and appear legit, while adding other information to get a reaction from certain fanbases. Then again, that is probably just wishful thinking on my part.

4. I agree, I am also really going to enjoy the Yohn Royce scene, because many people believe that the Vale will only be loyal to Sansa for some reason. But everyone in the Vale knows that Sansa and Littlefinger is connected. It actually makes sense for them to declare for Jon. With Jon as their King, they dont have to listen to Littlefinger and Sweet Robin first as their highest authority, their duty would be towards their King, so it is actually quite a happy solution for them.

4.5 The whole thing does feel like a way to push certain favorites. They like to humiliate Jon for some reason.

I think you are 100% right, they are trying to throw us off the scent of Jon becoming the King in the end, it is quite silly and over the top to have Jon kneel in the dragonpit.
I dont think Dany has to die.

After the war against the White Walkers is over, and perhaps Dany have lost all of her dragons by then, I think she might actually leave Westeros, getting the iron throne was Viserys' dream. In the books she always think back to that house with the red door. I think she might find that she doesn't really like Westeros, or she doesn't feel like she actually belongs in Westeros in the end.
She has lived her whole life in Essos, and freeing slaves was her own mission, I could see her continuing with that mission. There is always an emphasis on her being a conqueror and not a ruler. She could even try to create a new Valyrian empire but without slavery this time, then she might become an empress instead of a Queen.
If she just leave Westeros after the White Walkers, Jon would be forced to become the King and claim his Targaryen heritage. Jon has always wanted to be a Stark he will be forced to become Targaryen. Anyway, that is just an idea.

5. You summed it up perfectly, better than I could, that is exactly my problem with that scene. It is whitewashing and fanservice to make Arya appear more badass, but still socially acceptable enough at the same time. It would have been much better if these women just actually had minds of their own. It has been established continuously that noble women has their own sort of power. They don't just have to be mindless victims.

6. I agree about Littlefinger Sansa has all of the information to have him executed right now, and the Lords of the Vale wouldn't give a damn. He has enemies everywhere. In the books Tyrion knew that Littlefinger set him up with that dagger on purpose, yet he does nothing about. :roll:

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Flayed Potatoes
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Wed Jul 12, 2017 4:38 am

Boudica wrote:
Tue Jul 11, 2017 11:03 pm

I thought of the possibility that Dany might figure out the throne was Viserys' dream and not hers, but with the way she's written on the show, it would be a stretch for her to give it up and decide to return to Essos to do some more good there, or find her house with the red door (which didn't even get mentioned on the show). She'd need more development in season 8 than she's had over the course of the entire show, for that to be even slightly convincing imo.

Not to mention if she finds out Jon is her last surviving family, I don't see her leaving family to be alone again. And if they do sleep together and she has a kid, it would be out of character for her to abandon her child. If both Dany and Jon survive, I can't imagine her stepping down because Jon is the rightful heir, or because she no longer wants the throne or she feels like Westeros isn't her true home, based on how the show writes her. They write her as if sitting on a chair is her only goal/dream in life. And tbh it would be a huge disservice to Jon's character that after all he's been through and learned, he'll just become a royal consort despite being the actual heir (basically a glorified housewife on the show), which I actually see D&D doing because they don't much care for Jon anyway :roll: .

Boudica
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Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:07 pm

Funny enough there are a lot of fanfiction about Jon becoming a consort for Dany.

I do agree that Dany is always painted as wanting to become the Queen. I don't know, I think a lot could happen with Jon and Dany sleeping together, as well as his parentage being revealed. Jon is not going to be interested in becoming a Targaryen. I could perhaps see a situation where Dany's advisers will want Jon to claim some of his Targaryen lineage and they perhaps want him to marry someone else, in order to strengthen the Targaryen line and the future heir. And I could see Jon not being interested in this prospect, especially if he and Dany does have a bit of relationship and if she perhaps becomes pregnant. I could see a divide and some internal fighting. There is the idea that Jon might father a bastard, since he was so adamant that he would never father a bastard. Perhaps something like this could drive a wedge between them.
Leaving Westeros to create a new empire in Essos would not be a step down for Dany, it would be her, creating her own targets in life. Or perhaps she even realises that Jon would be better ruler for Westeros then she would be.

But anyways that is just one idea I came up with because of GRRM's outline where Dany, Jon, Tyrion, Arya and Bran all lives in the end. I think it is the one way how it could make sense, in a bittersweet ending. Then again some characters could still die at the very end.
Last edited by Boudica on Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:20 pm, edited 5 times in total.

Boudica
Posts: 115
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:50 am

Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:14 pm

I think Kit Harington has just inadvertently confirmed these spoilers/ summary for the first episode:

“I think Sansa twists him in a way that no one else can,” said Harington. “She infuriates him, she speaks up at times when it’s more helpful for him for her to not speak up. Essentially he’s got a problem: He’s leader, and she’s testing him, and as a leader you can’t have someone question you. But when it’s your sister there’s not much you can do about that. What are you meant to do? Punish your sister or execute your sister?
http://www.indiewire.com/2017/07/game-o ... 201854226/

JennyT
Posts: 58
Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2017 1:48 pm

Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:35 pm

Flayed Potatoes wrote:
Wed Jul 12, 2017 4:38 am
Boudica wrote:
Tue Jul 11, 2017 11:03 pm

I fully believe that Jon pledging to Dany is just for the twist that he is the legitimate heir.That way they tease the conflict.Not that it will happen but it's fodder for speculation in the offseason.That and the incest.As far as the ending goes I know that everybody says it's boring and cliche but what if they really do end up on the throne together ala Isabel and Ferdinand and William and Mary?I wouldn't put it past GRRM.

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Flayed Potatoes
Posts: 207
Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2017 1:31 pm

Wed Jul 12, 2017 3:40 pm

JennyT wrote:
Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:35 pm

I fully believe that Jon pledging to Dany is just for the twist that he is the legitimate heir.That way they tease the conflict.Not that it will happen but it's fodder for speculation in the offseason.That and the incest.As far as the ending goes I know that everybody says it's boring and cliche but what if they really do end up on the throne together ala Isabel and Ferdinand and William and Mary?I wouldn't put it past GRRM.
Oh definitely for the sake of the twist. It sounds like something D&D would do and then tease it like they're doing now with the Starkbowl.
Boudica wrote:
Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:14 pm
I think Kit Harington has just inadvertently confirmed these spoilers/ summary for the first episode:

“I think Sansa twists him in a way that no one else can,” said Harington. “She infuriates him, she speaks up at times when it’s more helpful for him for her to not speak up. Essentially he’s got a problem: He’s leader, and she’s testing him, and as a leader you can’t have someone question you. But when it’s your sister there’s not much you can do about that. What are you meant to do? Punish your sister or execute your sister?
http://www.indiewire.com/2017/07/game-o ... 201854226/
Not even surprised there's a lot of fanfic with that scenario. :roll:

Kit's interview definitely confirms the spoilers. And in the new batch of photos there's a guy painting the map of Westeros on the floor, which the new leaker also mentioned.

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